Cannon Lathe

Belt Drive Opportunity for You

All -

I'm adding a series of pics for the drive system in one of the 1893 machine shop on the site of the old Foundry. FWIW, the preservation society leader for this site is almost desperate for help to preserve the site - it can still be lost due to local political disinterest - not to say outright political animosity. There are numerous old machines in the building(s) including a large drop hammer, small lathe or facing machine, furnaces, etc. More pics later. He could sure use some help - they get together every other Saturday to work on the building and grounds.

The first two pics are the belt drop to a grinding station and the grinding station itself, the last two are the extended feed from the primary shaft over the shop main floor. The work station is in a separate room - note the old pass-though in the brick wall near the "new" motor on the wall. The electrics in here are museum vintage. Building is circa 1893, but similar to CW tooling in all respects.

Anybody know anybody with any influence in terms of designating sites of historical significance please say so.

Thanks for your interest in all this.

Enjoy.
 

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Preservation

mtnman,

Right across the aisle is one of the original Springfield stock shaping machines that is frequently turning a stock out of mahogany. I now understand the old line about being "Too loud to hear myself think".

TomH
 
Tom
Oh man, those belts slapping and the machinery running and the sound of the material being cut is enough to wake the dead. Not to mention that one wrong turn could get a body caught in a moving belt which meant almost certain death or dismemberment....... Not a safe place to be in the 1860's for sure. I stopped by a shop in NY where I am originally from once and it was belt driven.....we had to step outside to talk.....Great pictures....Thanks
I will have to show the guys I worked with so they know how good we had it compared to the guys working at the foundry there.
Claude
 
Steam Drop Hammer

Mtnman -

Here's a picture of the drop hammer in the Foundry Building in Selma - can you imagine the heat and noise associated with this momma when she was working?

I'm sure that if you wanted to help these guys put some of this stuff back together they'd be glad to have your expertise available!

Have a great Tennessee day (& glug glug from all the rain).
 
Selma Hunter
What an awesome find these things are! They really have enough stuff there to set up a nice working model of a Civil war era foundry/Iron works. Where exactly are all of these artifacts now? I am located about 30 miles south west of Nashville TN. I would love to go and see these things. Next month, I will be traveling to NY where I am originally from. Making stops in Fredricksburg, Spotsylvania, and Gettysburg on the way. Perhaps after that sometime.
Mtnman
 
Location of Foundry Shops

Mtnman -

Yes, they have enough stuff there to make a pretty good dent in a period shop operation. The shops are about 3 or 4 blocks off the main street in Selma. Crossing the river bridge towards (US Hwy 80 West - business) downtown, turn right at the foot of the bridge on Water Avenue and go straight ahead until you dead-end (sort of) at the Old Depot Museum (red brick with a beautiful old lathe out front), then angle to your right along the old River Road and you'll run into the Naval Foundry building on your right about 200 yards from the Old Depot Museum. The general area is a maze of old red brick buildings dating to the late 1800's. Railroad tracks everywhere.

If you will send me a PM I'll put you in touch with the guy who is essentially running the project down there. It is a neat collection of stuff and, of course, I have not posted pics of everything there. The new pic is either part of the old drive system or a pump. compressor, etc. Memory fails from time to time. Note the vintage of the attached motor!

This is a chance to save one of the last, if not the last remaining, of the few CSA Foundry facilities.

Your interest is much appreciated. And if the July trip is to the CW relic show in Gettysburg do give me a shout.

VBR,
 
Correction to Statement

All -

Since beginning this thread I have continued my research into the facilities in Selma known as, among other names, the "Selma Naval Gun Foundry". Through my continuing research I have come to believe that the building identified earlier in this thread as one of the Foundry buildings was in fact a smaller building occupied by a subcontractor - it is too small to have been a primary building in the casting process, and it is likely that most of what is known as the "Naval Foundry" was located as much as a block away from this site. As more information is uncovered I will attempt to post the updated material here for all to read.

Thank you all for allowing me to make my mistakes - I'll try to keep them to a minimum. FWIW, I (and interested others) would appreciate any information any of you might be able to share regarding the foundry, arsenal, navy yard, manufacturing of war materials in general, in Selma. Of particular interest is the location of the surviving Brooke Cannon that were made in Selma.

Many thanks,

Bill
 
Brooke Data

emike123 -

Thanks for the lead on the Brooke projectile - I am continually amazed at the prices these things will bring - not just the Brooke shells but all of them.

The cwartillery ;list of surviving guns lists about 1 dozen Brooke tubes but hasn't expanded the known list of Selma tubes - if I had his full list (5k+ tubes) I might find one or two more. I think I ran across something showing a couple of tubes in the New Orleans area - a very likely spot for Selma guns to surface. That would add a couple more to the list, and I'm trying to track another potential Selma tube in the Montgomery area.

Keep me posted if you will.

VBR,

Bill
 
Address Returned

Mike -

That email address was returned for some reason - got any suggestions for other means to contact him?

Bill
 
An Update

All -

It has been quite a while since I visited this posting and something of an update would seem in order. The research has progressed well and there is so much information out there to be found.

I think it was "dmbspike" who offered the thought that the building currently housing the shop equipment was NOT the original foundry building - I have to agree with him - & my best guess, along with some others, is that this building was part of the blacksmith shop that operated in conjunction with the naval foundry. The site of the existing "Old Depot" museum would have been the primary site for the Foundry proper, although the operation was certainly spread around several nearby blocks.

At this point I have visited the Selma Brooke guns located in Columbus, GA (inclusive of Linwood Cemetery), Ft. Morgan, AL, Jackson, AL, Choctaw Bluff, AL, Gainesville, AL and Selma. There are minor but curious differences between these tubes and the drawings produced by John M. Brooke's CS ordnance shops in Richmond. I was fortunate to have had an opportunity to speak with Mr. George M. Brooke, Jr. (JMB's grandson) this spring before he passed away in June. The result of that contact was a set of profile drawings of the 11, 10, 8, 7, and 6.4 inch guns inclusive of some of the sight details. The book by Mr. George Brooke titled "Ironclads and Big Guns of the Confederacy" comprising the edited papers of JMB during his war service is a wonderfully informative source and a "must read" for anyone who is a student of the big Brooke tubes. A site visitation to the Selma Brooke tubes in Charleston and the US Naval Yard is pending.

Field work has brought me into contact with one reinforce sight, and additional information about other key pieces of the Brooke implements. Further, complete drawings of the carriages are available, and there are examples of both iron front pivot and wooden style carriages surviving in the Mobile area. Extraordinary examples of the projectiles have also survived. What I have yet to see is a confirmed rear or elevation sight for one of the Brooke tubes. There is hope that a field recovered example may turn up at some point but that is, in fact, a matter of hope and not fact. There has been some speculation that the Naval Archives people are in possession of a full set of implements but calls to them for this information have not been productive so far.

Adding somewhat to the general research mix is my continued pursuit of the mysterious Selma-made metallic "quill" primers. Thus far my best guess is that these igniters were used in the "shore battery" mode only for the big guns. FWIW, efforts to-date have not produced field evidence supporting this theory for any site outside of Selma, but folks are searching.

The tube pictured here is number S-5 which was the first tube shipped from Selma to Admiral Buchanan (c/o Farrand) in Mobile in January 1864 and installed on the CSS Tennessee (II) in the aft pivot gun position. It is a 14,800 lb 7 inch rifled gun.

Questions are welcomed.

Please have a Happy and Safe 4th of July Holiday!
 
Bill,

Congratulations on your progress. I am sure it is 2 steps forward, one step backwards at times, but you are definitely moving the knowledge ball downfield!

I speak for many when I say I look forward to your publication. In the meantime, we applaud your excellent efforts.

Kind regards,

Mike
 
Kindness to Dumb Animals

emike -

My deep appreciation to you for your comments, although sometimes I feel like I'm being encouraged to play on the railroad tracks. Never did I imagine that this "thing" would become so all-encompassing of my day-to-day life. Neither did I ever imagine this "thing" becoming so fascinating or that it would lead me to meet and get to know so many fantastic people.

If anything is to be learned from any of my efforts it will be due to the generosity of diggers, collectors, land owners, divers, authors, experts, and others who have been kind enough to share with me - and at this point there is enough material in one pile for me to feel that I have largely succeeded with "Part 1" of my three part plan. The pile of Selma material is significant enough to begin to add some detail to the body of knowledge about what went on there during that war - otherwise the information and particularly the images were scattered to the four winds. Now, the next part is to sort it out some more and bring it into better focus. Dean is doing the "RBTRF IV" piece and I am anxiously awaiting that publication - like the rest of the world. He is the undisputed authority on arsenals of that period, IMHO. To try and "out write" him would be akin to sword fighting with Zorro. I'm simply waiting for that apple to fall from the tree (slobbering, I might add, like one of Pavlov's dogs - LOLOLOL).

The earlier work by Sol Tepper, Sr. and Mr. Ernest Johnston, Jr. opened so many doors .... I just want to add to what those gentlemen so capably began. So, my quest for any and all information and images about Selma continues.

My apologies to all for the "senior moment" in re-posting the image and information on S-5. On the other hand, she deserves to be seen again!

BTW, I have now "solved" the Garibaldi question.

Do have a Safe 4th, my friend.
 
More Brooke Gun Pics

emike123 -

Just for fun, take a look at there pics of some more Selma projectile images!


BTW, all I need now is a .54 Garibaldi!

VBR,

Bill
 

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Cannon Fodder Follies

All -

I thought that perhaps some of you might find the attached photo of interest - it reflects my efforts to record the precise dimensions of S-5 as currently situated in front of City Hall in Selma. Of course, S-5 was the first Selma Brooke shipped and served as the aft pivot gun on the Tennessee (II) during the Battle of Mobile Bay in August of '64.

More to come.
 
All -

Time for a brief update. This spring, as my Selma Research Project moves on towards publication, I ran across a copy of the contract between Colin J. McRae and the Confederate Government selling what became the Naval Gun Foundry and Ordnance Works parcel to the government. It not only detailed the location of the foundry parcel but included an inventory of the foundry buildings - one by one. There was one lathe (among many listed) that could handle work 20 feet long and weighing 30,000 pounds. That is about right to deal with the "blank" for an 11 inch gun weighing almost 24,000 pounds in finished form.

What is even more remarkable is the realization that gun tube No. S-125 was a unique specimen. It was shipped to Mobile in March of 1865, and as the ONLY 11 RIFLED Double Banded Brooke Gun made there had to be projectiles manufactured for it as well. Thus far the collecting community has not been able to identify such a projectile, but yankee records indicate that they were on the receiving end of some 230 lb "samples" inside the Ft. Blakeley lines in April - just before the surrender of the area. We continue to search.

S-5, the 7" DB Brooke rifle that served as the aft pivot gun on the Tennessee II has been reconditioned and remounted in downtown Selma, AL. It is a beautifully done project and the SCV community and others connected therewith are to be thanked & commended for their work on this project. Numerous civic minded citizens contributed. A historical marker is now a part of this display.

Cheers to all,
 
Having lost an extensive posting yesterday, I'll try again.

In August my son Parker and I traveled to Greensboro, Petersburg, Richmond, and the Washington Navy Yard. In Greensboro Parker and I visited the Greensboro Historical Museum and the Murphy Collection of Confederate longarms. Impressive. In Petersburg we visited the battlefield park and some of the gun tubes on display, and generally familiarized ourselves with the area. Richmond found us at the Tredegar Works NPS Museum, and enthralled with the diorama depicting the casting of cannon. Due to rain and some mobility issues Parker became my eyes and cameraman in the capturing of pictures of the large cannon lathe in one of the outside displays. These were particularly informative in that for the first time I could visualize the facilities in Selma. The processes and procedures involved in cannon making in Selma would have been highly similar if not identical to those in Tredegar, and would explain some of the depictions of three and four story brick buildings not otherwise accounted for in surviving records.

The superbly constructed diorama depicts the casting room with lifting cranes, casting pits, filling troughs, flasks, moulds, workers, etc. in the several stages of the casting process. In the larger bore sizes (10 & 11 inches) the raw castings would have weighed as much as 30,000 pounds, and would have resulted in finished tubes weighing about 23,000 pounds.
 

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